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	<title>Comments on: Corner of Hyat St &amp; Kossuth St</title>
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	<description>down and out with the city's vacants</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 03:22:57 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Desert T</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-171</link>
		<dc:creator>Desert T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 01:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>It&#039;s been about 20 years, area still looks as ugly as ever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s been about 20 years, area still looks as ugly as ever.</p>
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		<title>By: Stump Blankenship</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-167</link>
		<dc:creator>Stump Blankenship</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 17:03:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Have you been by Desert T?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have you been by Desert T?</p>
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		<title>By: Desert T</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-166</link>
		<dc:creator>Desert T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 13:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Still looks like a hell hole.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Still looks like a hell hole.</p>
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		<title>By: Faust</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-57</link>
		<dc:creator>Faust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 01:34:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-57</guid>
		<description>Mr. St. Lawrence,
 
I am sorry that you found my comments to be so &quot;wrong headed&quot; but please allow me to respond.
 
 
 
@Faust
You don’t know what you’re talking about. 
 
This is America, and you are entitled to your opinion. On the other hand, you should know that I supported myself for many years by renovating buildings much like those pictured here. So far as I know, they are still considered desireable, are happily occupied and none has ever been foreclosed.
 
If neighborhoods have a “lifetime,” then what about the East Side where the housing stock is older and the occupancy denser? Does this have a lifetime?
 
You have selected a poor example. By the East Side, I assume you are talking about Benefit street and the area of Fox Point around Wickenden (that has only become the East Side since the real estate brokers began marketing it as such). Perhaps you are not old enough to remember when Benefit Street was a rooming house/flop house area. It had run out its &quot;lifetime&quot; and required &quot;re-birth&quot;. Lady Fortune stepped in. Doris Duke (American Tobacco) killed her husband in their driveway, many said it was murder. She then began attempting to buy her way into heaven. One of her projects was to buy several flop houses on Benefit Street and renovate them. She also persuaded several of her fashionable friends to do so. This was financed out of their pockets.  As luck would have it, this tied in with the &quot;back to the city&quot; movement of the 70&#039;s and a HUD that was amenable to dealing with individuals. The Providence Preservation Society also aided. The downside of the HUD program was that it was restricted to the &quot;Historic District&quot;. I don&#039;t recall the street names, but you can still see the borders of the district. On one side of the street (inside the district) the houses are renovated, on the other side they are not. 
 
 And what about the parking? This neighborhood has more than the East Side and actually more than most areas of the city. 
 
Look around the East Side and consider the sums which must have been expended to create parking. This only emphasizes its importance. 
 
 
Your attempts to justify and rationalize this blight are pathetic. 
 
That is, of course, your opinion. I am not given to pathos.
 
It tells me that you’re just like the “investors” and assorted vermin who came into this neighborhood and destroyed it by trying to make a quick buck.
 
I wouldn&#039;t know about that, I strive to avoid associating with vermin.

You and the absentee landlords should be forced to live in this area, preferably next door to one these boarded-up houses. I’m sure it would change your perspective.
 
In my lifetime, I have lived in neighborhoods like that.

Real people live in this neighborhood with hopes and dreams, just like you. They should not have to live in conditions not fit for the shelter of human beings.
 
Admitting that they have hopes and dreams, the question then becomes do they have ambition. In the current climate housing prices have been much reduced, both for rental and purchase. One wonders why they are not voting with their feet. I can assure you that acceptable housing is now available at costs far less than renovating much of the property shown here. &quot;For Rent&quot; and &quot;For Sale&quot; signs abound.

Something to consider, particularly with your reference to the East Side. Blighted areas make a greater demand on municipal budgets than areas like the East Side. These blighted neighborhoods do not pay enough taxes to support themselves. Consequently the &quot;East Sides&quot; of the world are heavily taxed to support the blighted neighborhoods. As the blighted neighborhoods become more so, the tax base reduces and civic costs increase. As the tax burden on the more dessireable neighborhoods increases, they become less desireable. Consequently, the tax payers depart. The formerly &quot;fashionable neighborhoods&quot; become blighted, increasing the burden on the city for want of funds. New Haven is a rather good example of this, but there are many.

As I said earlier, this area is a monument to the “free market” system where everything and anyone is for sale.
 
I suspect you believe that the &quot;free market&quot; has not treated you very well and that has caused you to prefer a Robin Hood theory of economics. To quote one economist, or another, &quot;you eventually run out of other peoples money&quot;. On reflection, I am sure you will realize that the &quot;free market&quot; has created America out of almost nothing. That is not a small accomplishment, it is unique in the world. If you think the system is poor here, visit Rio. Almost 50% of the population is homeless. Brazil has all of the natural resources we have, so why? Could it be the economic system? Almost everything is regulated by the government there. As it was with the British in the 60&#039;s and 70&#039;s, well to do Brazilians are fleeing to America. The situation in Brazil worsens. England lowered taxes significantly and &quot;muddled through&quot;.

Good luck. If you have any questions on &quot;rehab&quot;, post them and I will attempt to respond.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. St. Lawrence,</p>
<p>I am sorry that you found my comments to be so &#8220;wrong headed&#8221; but please allow me to respond.</p>
<p>@Faust<br />
You don’t know what you’re talking about. </p>
<p>This is America, and you are entitled to your opinion. On the other hand, you should know that I supported myself for many years by renovating buildings much like those pictured here. So far as I know, they are still considered desireable, are happily occupied and none has ever been foreclosed.</p>
<p>If neighborhoods have a “lifetime,” then what about the East Side where the housing stock is older and the occupancy denser? Does this have a lifetime?</p>
<p>You have selected a poor example. By the East Side, I assume you are talking about Benefit street and the area of Fox Point around Wickenden (that has only become the East Side since the real estate brokers began marketing it as such). Perhaps you are not old enough to remember when Benefit Street was a rooming house/flop house area. It had run out its &#8220;lifetime&#8221; and required &#8220;re-birth&#8221;. Lady Fortune stepped in. Doris Duke (American Tobacco) killed her husband in their driveway, many said it was murder. She then began attempting to buy her way into heaven. One of her projects was to buy several flop houses on Benefit Street and renovate them. She also persuaded several of her fashionable friends to do so. This was financed out of their pockets.  As luck would have it, this tied in with the &#8220;back to the city&#8221; movement of the 70&#8242;s and a HUD that was amenable to dealing with individuals. The Providence Preservation Society also aided. The downside of the HUD program was that it was restricted to the &#8220;Historic District&#8221;. I don&#8217;t recall the street names, but you can still see the borders of the district. On one side of the street (inside the district) the houses are renovated, on the other side they are not. </p>
<p> And what about the parking? This neighborhood has more than the East Side and actually more than most areas of the city. </p>
<p>Look around the East Side and consider the sums which must have been expended to create parking. This only emphasizes its importance. </p>
<p>Your attempts to justify and rationalize this blight are pathetic. </p>
<p>That is, of course, your opinion. I am not given to pathos.</p>
<p>It tells me that you’re just like the “investors” and assorted vermin who came into this neighborhood and destroyed it by trying to make a quick buck.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t know about that, I strive to avoid associating with vermin.</p>
<p>You and the absentee landlords should be forced to live in this area, preferably next door to one these boarded-up houses. I’m sure it would change your perspective.</p>
<p>In my lifetime, I have lived in neighborhoods like that.</p>
<p>Real people live in this neighborhood with hopes and dreams, just like you. They should not have to live in conditions not fit for the shelter of human beings.</p>
<p>Admitting that they have hopes and dreams, the question then becomes do they have ambition. In the current climate housing prices have been much reduced, both for rental and purchase. One wonders why they are not voting with their feet. I can assure you that acceptable housing is now available at costs far less than renovating much of the property shown here. &#8220;For Rent&#8221; and &#8220;For Sale&#8221; signs abound.</p>
<p>Something to consider, particularly with your reference to the East Side. Blighted areas make a greater demand on municipal budgets than areas like the East Side. These blighted neighborhoods do not pay enough taxes to support themselves. Consequently the &#8220;East Sides&#8221; of the world are heavily taxed to support the blighted neighborhoods. As the blighted neighborhoods become more so, the tax base reduces and civic costs increase. As the tax burden on the more dessireable neighborhoods increases, they become less desireable. Consequently, the tax payers depart. The formerly &#8220;fashionable neighborhoods&#8221; become blighted, increasing the burden on the city for want of funds. New Haven is a rather good example of this, but there are many.</p>
<p>As I said earlier, this area is a monument to the “free market” system where everything and anyone is for sale.</p>
<p>I suspect you believe that the &#8220;free market&#8221; has not treated you very well and that has caused you to prefer a Robin Hood theory of economics. To quote one economist, or another, &#8220;you eventually run out of other peoples money&#8221;. On reflection, I am sure you will realize that the &#8220;free market&#8221; has created America out of almost nothing. That is not a small accomplishment, it is unique in the world. If you think the system is poor here, visit Rio. Almost 50% of the population is homeless. Brazil has all of the natural resources we have, so why? Could it be the economic system? Almost everything is regulated by the government there. As it was with the British in the 60&#8242;s and 70&#8242;s, well to do Brazilians are fleeing to America. The situation in Brazil worsens. England lowered taxes significantly and &#8220;muddled through&#8221;.</p>
<p>Good luck. If you have any questions on &#8220;rehab&#8221;, post them and I will attempt to respond.</p>
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		<title>By: John St Lawrence</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-56</link>
		<dc:creator>John St Lawrence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Apr 2009 16:30:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-56</guid>
		<description>@Faust
     You don&#039;t know what you&#039;re talking about. If neighborhoods have a &quot;lifetime,&quot; then what about the East Side where the housing stock is older and the occupancy denser? Does this have a lifetime? And what about the parking? This neighborhood has more than the East Side and actually more than most areas of the city. Your attempts to justify and rationalize this blight are pathetic. It tells me that you&#039;re just like the &quot;investors&quot; and assorted vermin who came into this neighborhood and destroyed it by trying to make a quick buck.
     You and the absentee landlords should be forced to live in this area, preferably next door to one these boarded-up houses. I&#039;m sure it would change your perspective. 
     Real people live in this neighborhood with hopes and dreams, just like you. They should not have to live in conditions not fit for the shelter of human beings.
     As I said earlier, this area is a monument to the &quot;free market&quot; system where everything and anyone is for sale.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Faust<br />
     You don&#8217;t know what you&#8217;re talking about. If neighborhoods have a &#8220;lifetime,&#8221; then what about the East Side where the housing stock is older and the occupancy denser? Does this have a lifetime? And what about the parking? This neighborhood has more than the East Side and actually more than most areas of the city. Your attempts to justify and rationalize this blight are pathetic. It tells me that you&#8217;re just like the &#8220;investors&#8221; and assorted vermin who came into this neighborhood and destroyed it by trying to make a quick buck.<br />
     You and the absentee landlords should be forced to live in this area, preferably next door to one these boarded-up houses. I&#8217;m sure it would change your perspective.<br />
     Real people live in this neighborhood with hopes and dreams, just like you. They should not have to live in conditions not fit for the shelter of human beings.<br />
     As I said earlier, this area is a monument to the &#8220;free market&#8221; system where everything and anyone is for sale.</p>
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		<title>By: Faust</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>Faust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 05:04:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-54</guid>
		<description>gregg j, your thoughts reflect the experience of many &quot;urban pioneers&quot;. They move in and begin fixing up. Soon, the kids reach school age and they rethink the entire situation. This usually means a move to the suburbs. 

The tough part of this situation is that there are plenty of foreclosures in suburban areas. Prices are only slightly higher, but all in, the final cost is about the same. It is no accident that over 50% of the forclosures in the U.S. are located in 37 counties. They were never desireable areas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>gregg j, your thoughts reflect the experience of many &#8220;urban pioneers&#8221;. They move in and begin fixing up. Soon, the kids reach school age and they rethink the entire situation. This usually means a move to the suburbs. </p>
<p>The tough part of this situation is that there are plenty of foreclosures in suburban areas. Prices are only slightly higher, but all in, the final cost is about the same. It is no accident that over 50% of the forclosures in the U.S. are located in 37 counties. They were never desireable areas.</p>
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		<title>By: gregg j</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-51</link>
		<dc:creator>gregg j</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 16:44:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-51</guid>
		<description>is this what we have come to in rhode island? i stay here for my wifes sake and all i see are houses left for dead and are bad on property values. i am in the market for a new home and every house i go to see has a house like this next to or on the same street. i have three kids and don&#039;t want them to live next to a eye sore or safty risk like this. i wish someone in rhode island goverment would help us</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>is this what we have come to in rhode island? i stay here for my wifes sake and all i see are houses left for dead and are bad on property values. i am in the market for a new home and every house i go to see has a house like this next to or on the same street. i have three kids and don&#8217;t want them to live next to a eye sore or safty risk like this. i wish someone in rhode island goverment would help us</p>
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		<title>By: Faust</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>Faust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 16:09:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-50</guid>
		<description>Can&#039;t help myself, I need to go on. Government is part of the problem here. These buildings were built when families were larger, and people walked. What is needed now is smaller apartments and parking spaces. The lot sizes are very small, Zoning regulations require a minimum square footage of &quot;lot size&quot; per unit. This hampers subdivision of the buildings into smaller units. (most of the multi units you see in these neighborhoods are probably &quot;illegal&quot;, code enforcement would shut them down) There is no correlation between unit size and the lot size required. Small units require the same footage as large ones. There is just not enough lot size to provide sufficient parking for a formerly 2 unit building which is converted to a 4 unit. This is part of what made these neighborhoods undesireable over time. Zoning typically requires a minimum number of parking spaces per unit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can&#8217;t help myself, I need to go on. Government is part of the problem here. These buildings were built when families were larger, and people walked. What is needed now is smaller apartments and parking spaces. The lot sizes are very small, Zoning regulations require a minimum square footage of &#8220;lot size&#8221; per unit. This hampers subdivision of the buildings into smaller units. (most of the multi units you see in these neighborhoods are probably &#8220;illegal&#8221;, code enforcement would shut them down) There is no correlation between unit size and the lot size required. Small units require the same footage as large ones. There is just not enough lot size to provide sufficient parking for a formerly 2 unit building which is converted to a 4 unit. This is part of what made these neighborhoods undesireable over time. Zoning typically requires a minimum number of parking spaces per unit.</p>
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		<title>By: Faust</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Faust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 15:51:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-49</guid>
		<description>The above comment extolling a form of socialism simply ignores the facts of life. Neighborhoods, like almost everything, have a lifetime. They come and go. They serve a purpose and then require &quot;rebirth&quot;. The neighborhoods we see here were products of a time when America was far less mobile, families rented apartments for 20 years. At that time, everyone walked. It  may seem &quot;romantic&quot; in retrospect, but it is nonetheless gone.

For all of the evils of capitalism. After watching the government at work in New Orleans, would you want FEMA in charge of housing programs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The above comment extolling a form of socialism simply ignores the facts of life. Neighborhoods, like almost everything, have a lifetime. They come and go. They serve a purpose and then require &#8220;rebirth&#8221;. The neighborhoods we see here were products of a time when America was far less mobile, families rented apartments for 20 years. At that time, everyone walked. It  may seem &#8220;romantic&#8221; in retrospect, but it is nonetheless gone.</p>
<p>For all of the evils of capitalism. After watching the government at work in New Orleans, would you want FEMA in charge of housing programs.</p>
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		<title>By: John St Lawrence</title>
		<link>http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/corner-of-hyat-st-kossuth-st-providence-ri/comment-page-1/#comment-40</link>
		<dc:creator>John St Lawrence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 16:17:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forgottenprovidence.com/?p=407#comment-40</guid>
		<description>What needs to be done is to publish the names of these &quot;investors&quot; and banks who own these properties. In a society where private property is sacrosanct, an owner can just board-up their property and leave it for years. They have no responsibility to the neighbors or the neighborhood. What happens eventually is an urban no-man&#039;s land, where no bank will offer credit  and no owner/occupant will purchase. Block after block will be torched or abandoned. 
In a just society, owners would be forced to either bring their houses up to code, sell, or tear them down. Instead, we have peacock politicians doing photo-ops while conditions inexorably deteriorate. Even the Diocese of Providence has closed St. Theresa&#039;s Church, which provided advocacy, activism, and support to this community. This neighborhood and its people have been written-off until the area can be profitably exploited by urban developers using taxpayer subsidies. This is the reality despite what anyone tells you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What needs to be done is to publish the names of these &#8220;investors&#8221; and banks who own these properties. In a society where private property is sacrosanct, an owner can just board-up their property and leave it for years. They have no responsibility to the neighbors or the neighborhood. What happens eventually is an urban no-man&#8217;s land, where no bank will offer credit  and no owner/occupant will purchase. Block after block will be torched or abandoned.<br />
In a just society, owners would be forced to either bring their houses up to code, sell, or tear them down. Instead, we have peacock politicians doing photo-ops while conditions inexorably deteriorate. Even the Diocese of Providence has closed St. Theresa&#8217;s Church, which provided advocacy, activism, and support to this community. This neighborhood and its people have been written-off until the area can be profitably exploited by urban developers using taxpayer subsidies. This is the reality despite what anyone tells you.</p>
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